sig p320 accidental discharge 2021 sig p320 accidental discharge 2021

So even if, as the ambulance chaser claims, the striker leg could vibrate off of the sear face, it could not discharge unless the drop safety was also disengaged because the drop safety prevents movement of the striker sufficient to make the firing pin protrude from the breech face. As for Seals they have their own contract with Glock but can carry anything they want. Good job! I just separate Shatner the man from Kirk the character, which he plays with Shakespearian operatic perfection. Maybe in South America a poor military did, but thatd be about it. In my opinion, the only reason SIG would have done that is if they knew there was a safety problem with the original gun, otherwise they would not have done it., Scott says Harrison reviewed the claims in Officer Hiltons lawsuit and said, its unclear to (Harrison) what could now be causing misfires in the upgraded guns., Scott then asked Harrison if he believes the P320 should be removed from the marketplace. LOL! Going on Sigs reputation I bought a P320. It sounds the same as arguing whether Captain Marvel could beat Superman up in a fist fight its pretty absurd and laughable. Where is this lightning striking twice? The second version emphasized the upgrade to fix the drop safety issue and notes that Harrison believes that problem has been fixed. Capitol Police Officers Explanation for Shooting and Killing Ashli Babbitt Is Riddled With Problems, The City of Wichita Raked In Almost $200,000 Selling Seized Guns in the Last Five Years, State Judge Issues Order Blocking Enforcement of Illinois Firearms Ban Act Statewide, Federal Judge Grants Injunction Blocking Enforcement of ATFs Frame or Receiver Rule, Illinois Rep. Bob Morgan: Anything Stamped M&P is a Weapon of War, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h-ZZ6pynGLM, https://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/dea-agent-lee-paige-still-wont-go-away/, https://sofrep.com/news/dod-evaluation-says-armys-new-sig-sauer-p320-service-pistol-riddled-issues/, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v0LUbLu6TqA, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jsu6WsSQ2_g, https://millsentertainment.smugmug.com/William-Shatner-The-Wrath-of-Khan. And yes, if I pulled some of those stunts, Id have my membership revoked. In fact, I dont own ANY striker fired polymer pistol. Folks disagree on brands. COPYRIGHT 2021, THETRUTHABOUTGUNS.COM. Heres the version of the report that ran later that night, during ABCs Nightline program . . My trust for Sig stopped after they produced the beloved Sig556xi Russian. Even if it was an issue with the sear interface, there is still a firing pin safety that will not move unless the trigger is held firmly to the rear. Contacted late Friday, a spokeswoman for special forces said the investigation is still ongoing and would not confirm the companys findings. Were not saying that the suits against GLOCK are any more (or less) substantiated than those against SIG. About $300. In the former case, you would need upward movement coming to a sudden stop to bump up the drop safety at the same time you imparted rearward momentum to the gun to try and move the striker. In June, Cambridge police Lt. Thomas Ahern filed suit, accusing Sig Sauer of selling a dangerously defective product after his P320 fired on its own while he was in the department's SWAT team van with six other officers. That wont last for long, the P320 (M17 AND M18) are already failing in the field. 3) If the sear fails, there is the drop safety in the way of the striker. They simply have never been seen in the upper echelon of handgun makers, their entire business model is to offer cheaper guns at cheaper prices. The more someone touches, loads, clears, cleans, holsters, un-holsters, or otherwise deals with their firearm, the higher the statistical likelihood that complacence kicks in. . Fact is most SF carry what they want and the Marine Recon I know very well who has friends in that community told me many in the Navy NSW program still carry the Mk 25, they don want a striker fired pistol that can hydrolock in water. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. So it never had a history of a potential valid claim for ambulance chasers to work off of. Aint been nothing but problems since the military dropped the 1911, what was it 85 year of trusted service? Again, these are examples the plaintiff in this case is using to support his claim that the P320 is prone to un-commanded discharges.. It nicely describes what has to happen in a striker-fired P320 for an un-commanded discharge to happen as the plaintiffs have claimed. One of the officers a few years ago was carrying his P320 in a P226 holster that he took a Dremel to make the P320 fit. You need a lead that can be the lightening rod and not be afraid to make an ass of themselvesit give the watcher permission to take it seriously. On Nov. 5, 2020, a recently-purchased SIG Sauer P320 pistol went off unexpectedly at a training range in Dwyer Hill, outside of Ottawa. They are plaintiffs versions of what they say happened. I still own them all. She didnt sue, but swore she would never own another Volvo again. abprototype.com can add the manual safety as well as add the notches in the grip frame. The SIG will be the shortest military contract for guns in history. Its pathetic how often these legal stunts work. The 1911 had one added, the FN 1905 had one added in 1906. Once investigated a shot fired into a roll top desk. Not much detail is provided in any of those other claimed incidents, but a few stand out. The use of a modified [SIG] P226 holster created an unsafe condition by allowing a foreign object to enter the holster, causing the unintended discharge.. I can say one thing for sure, the X on the side of the my is about is welcoming to me as grip zone was. In 2021 you would think a company would understand MIM metallurgy. Not sure why it wont let me reply to you, but Ill reply to myself in the hope youll get it. It sure wasnt her fault though, because she was flooring the. This is what happens when you go with the lowest bidder. They didnt have to, but did. So I give a ton of credit to Shatner for reading the reality of what it was and in essence, saving it. Sig, take this firearm off the market, and recall. I lost $200 on a gun that had less then 1000 rounds through it but I could care. The bullet struck a soldier in the leg. Lastly, ship-wise I have to go with the TMP-era refit Enterprise, regardless of Captain. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h-ZZ6pynGLM Good thing you werent serious, thatd be terr..uh.oops. Why you and I are arguing over a gun that neither owns or will own, Yesterday, a Canadian news outlet, CBC News, published a story regarding the unintended discharge last year of a SIG P320 by a Canadian Special Operator, resulting in injury and his unit withdrawing the pistol from service. If you can make the trigger move backwards, all bets are off. At least the Gorilla is still evolving while the Far Right proved to be an evolutionary dead end, one of natures mistakes. Trust a P365 with your life. U.S. lawsuits Whats the difference between a $600 Sig and a $300 Taurus? Especially since they farm it out to the lowest bidder. Sig P320 discharge while holstered. The Glock fails on both counts. Training and experience are not a talisman that magically prevents accidents. The new Tauruses have a good rep, far better then the P320 or P365. The real tell is that of all the cases, most are cops of some kind. The heads up testing was immediately finished the Sig was the winner. This highly trained Fibbie was doing flips while dancing (breakdancing? There are tens of millions of gun owners, far more than there are cops, and the VAST majority of those folks buy their guns and drop them a nightstand drawer or up on a closet shelf and leave it until theyre needed. Third, Glock has had problems, too. I mean hey, yelling about firearms preferences online is no more productive than discussing nerdy Star Trek stuff, is it? No Warp core, just a quantum singularity, The engine was basically a dorm fridge. The second accidental shooting happened after police supervisors internally raised questions about the safety of the SIG Sauer P320. Thats why the US Marines have Sigs. SIG Sauer, a German weapons maker with its U.S. headquarters in Newington, N.H., issued a statement Friday in response to a CBC News report earlier this week that revealed the Nov. 5, 2020, incident and the fact the weapon, the SIG P320, had been withdrawn from service while the military conducts an investigation. Zero in the affirmative. This subject has two prongs; One is the negligence of those who have shot themselves with 320s through violations of Rule 2, the other the possible mechanical design failing of the gun. Canadian soldier. Both versions of the ABC report included comments from Officer Hiltons attorney, Jeffrey Bagnell, who said, Its not credible to claim that people with this amount of training, this amount of skill are all shooting themselves. A few Warbirds decloaking would make me very nervous if it wasnt sci-fi fantasy. I dont care about the upgrade that should never happen. Bravo. Sigs bid was low because they were still pissed after being beat by Beretta in cost. The Milwaukee Police Department reports "multiple unexplained accidental discharges" of the Sig Sauer P320 9mm, a gun all officers are required to carry, making for more than 1,600 firearms. That focus drifts. Anyway around here they do. By hoping Sig gets taken down for the P320, theyre actually setting up their own pet brand to be the next on the chopping block. I dont own a P320. Too much MIM in that crap SIG, the old ones were great. It was expensive. Grow up, you aint all that! Covid ruined that gravy train for him but hes still doing the conventions. The military has found that the pistol has a tendency to eject live rounds among other issues. Have you ever put a handgun down with your palm in front of the muzzle? Either one could have been a gun or a Barbie. It has an unsafe takedown procedure that requires you to pull the trigger to get the slide off. Post again when you buy a real gun that you can defend yourself with. L. LRRifleman . Such being the case, there very well may BE in inherent design flaw in the gun; We shouldnt just cast the thought aside as being beyond consideration and insist on blaming the problem on operator error.. Having it as the ONLY trigger pull the weapon has seems (to me) clearly dangerous. Jeff Bagnell, a lawyer in Westport, Conn., who has litigated 10 cases, mostly by commercial gun owners, related to SIG P320 misfires across several U.S. states, took note of the accident involving the Canadian special forces soldier. Charlton, headquartered in Victoria, B.C., for comment on its original story, but neither responded. Upgrades are for things that didnt work right in the first place. They have similar vertical sear engagement, but the M&P has more engagement width wise. Hey, Im sitting here staring at my P320, waiting for it to go bang! Cars have so many electronics these days, who knows what could have gone wrong! A plastic gun that has a tendency to go off by itself. Hilton has filed a $15 million lawsuit alleging the P320 has a serious design and manufacturing flaw. Sig P320 is just one of many pistols with Safety related. I know off body carry is a recipe for disaster. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jsu6WsSQ2_g. Ironic that the trendsetters of yesteryear are trying to tear down the innovator of today because its Not perfected yet! and the Design isnt worked out!. How about something more relevant. But this time, the sound bites used were different. 35446 Views 56 Replies 41 Participants Last post by tirod, Sep 1, 2021. You would have to conclude theres a problem with the product, not with the people., In the Nightline version, Bagnell says, Firearms are not subject to federal regulation. Back in 2017, SIG instituted a voluntary upgrade program to replace the original production triggers with new enhanced triggers designed to fix the issue that we and others observed when the pistols were dropped onto hard surfaces. The incident with the P320 - a contender for a major Canadian Armed Forces procurement of thousands of pistols and holsters that has a Aug. 3 deadline for industry proposals - occurred at JTF-2's Dwyer Hill training range just west of Ottawa. On February 19, 2021, Military.com reported: A former U.S. Marine and federal agent has filed a $10 million lawsuit against Sig Sauer Inc. alleging that his holstered Sig P320 a pistol that the Army's new sidearm is based on accidentally discharged, firing a 9mm bullet into his right leg. Later when he was driving he shifted his weight and this caused the trigger to be pushed back further and it went off and shot him and the bullet then also blew a big hole in the floor board of this truck. The HK VP70 was made in 1970 when Gaston Glock was making curtain rods. They suck and Im awesome!, 2. Depending on who you talk to you will get many different answers. Excellent work. At least the Lion roars when he is hungry, the C.E.O smiles at you and when you turn your back he puts a knife right into it. But I hope Sig fights it until the bitterest of ends. Theyre cheering for a noose around their own precious Glocks throat. Harrison stated that, I have not seen enough to convince me that the upgraded version is dangerous., When ABCs David Scott asked Harrison if its a mystery whats going wrong with the updated version though Harrison had just stated the upgraded pistol isnt dangerous Harrison said, I do not have an explanation for why the updated version should have complaints from trained individuals. He was told to shoot two rounds. So I will just continue to carry Mexican style with my striker fired polymer wonder nine from a company that may or may not be SIG. These lawsuits arent about Sig making a defective weapon, theyre about lawyers building a nationwide consensus in civil trial that makes it easier (and more lucrative) to soak gunmakers. This is why we now have back up safeties on garden tractors and riding lawn mowers. No autographs, No self taken pictures. Thats deflecting from the real issue. If this were a car, a phone, a refrigerator, it would have been recalled long ago. They mandate more discharges, with more property damage, more injuries, and more deaths. A holstered base P320 allegedly had a mysterious accidental discharge without pulling the trigger. There are several stories about her in the news for various no reasons, she must be throwing them out by a dozen. Trying to categorically say Brand X is better than Brand Y! So far I have only heard of one instance (post fix) where there was an ND and the post mortem on the gun demonstrating a mechanical failure. Whether or not the suits have merit. The cost of settlements will be passed on to us. For instance theres Lieutenant Thomas Ahern who was was performing a routine function (test) of his P320 when it fired at him without any force towards the trigger, resulting in the bullet impacting his left thigh.. It SHOULD have more engagement width wise, but often doesnt due to things being rounded or out of square. Look a fanboy. I sold that pistol when I got it back. The same should hold true for the insane marketing of pistols like the totally unsafe Glock. Profits over reliability and you end up with junk. The guys at the LGS saw only one broken striker but it confirmed what the manager who had the P320 go off and my thoughts. Get a dead trigger when the striker breaks. And those are exactly the kinds of plaintiffs who happen to make up the vast majority of the lawsuits filed against SIG. I continue to bet my life on them. The American manufacturer of the new pistols belonging to Canadas special forces claims the soldier wounded in an accidental discharge last fall was using the wrong holster for the weapon. These cops seem pretty dang stupid if they put loaded guns in gym bags and purses with other stuff and carry them around, especially a gun that lacks manual safeties. Sig Sauer Inc. has agreed to settle a class-action lawsuit over its P320 pistol, on which the Army 's Modular Handgun System is based. ABC News ran two reports on the topic last week, highlighting one particular cop in Bridge City, Texas who is suing SIG for $15 million. Glock's and Sig P320 are all designated as Double-Action-Only fire control mechanisms. Canadian Special Forces Command has not said what caused the gun to go off unexpectedly, but the company said a conclusion has been reached. It provides another example of how the gun free zone purportedly keeps people safe by not only keeping guns away, but by requiring more discharges nearby. My bet would be that someone had a fully loaded gun in a gym bag and a cloth or rag snagged the trigger. In 1974 if you bought a Colt 1911, you left the gun store and then immediately took it to your favorite gunsmith and said Make it work it with Super-Vels, please. You cant get away with that today. When a consumer product is likely to be operated in such a way that it causes accidents because it is way too easy to make a serious mistake because of human error when operating it the manufactures are told that the machine must be made safer. Slowly people are realizing they arent the only ones having issues. But it hardly indicts the P320 as a badly engineered weapon or that its worse than another brand. If the P320 was so great then why did special forces go to the Glock 19? Had a buddy, years ago, that was a deputy for Orange County in California. Sig makes a damn fine weapon and theres nothing wrong with it. Guess it hasnt dawned on them that: 1. You couldnt ask questions. That a shirt tail or jacket cinch cord slips into a holster. https://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/dea-agent-lee-paige-still-wont-go-away/. The pictures on the internet were enough to scare the shit out of you especially his wound in the thigh. And I suspect at end of day this recent P320 one will be identified as a negligent discharge or from weapons from 2017 where owners failed to . Sig fanboys are almost as bad as Glock fanboys. Everyone knows Glocks are the absolute pinnacle of perfection and have never had one single defect ever! The Milwaukee police department has had 3 incidents of the Sig discharging while being in a holster sitting in a patrol car in 2023. And as far as Special Forces go, SF going to Glock has been documented as a bean counters solution to save money. It seems safe to assume that while SIG is coming up fast on the outside, GLOCK is still most likely the reigning champ in terms of the firearms most often carried by law enforcement and other government agencies. The safety WILL prevent the gun from firing with a trigger pull when activated, but it should never come to that. Cops are crap with guns, unlike me, a REAL pistolero! three changes to the original design. Im more of a DS9 guy. I can say we are aware of the statement released by SIG SAUER, said Maj. Amber Bineau. But it also has much worse quality control on the parts in my experience owning and working on both. It takes time for any new platform to work the kinks out. I was tempted to buy one at one time but no more. I love when people call law enforcement officers highly trained. Most dont get more training than what they had in the academy unless they are getting paid time to train, or are going for something speciality such as S.W.A.T. Glocks biggest problem is they havent innovated since 1985. 1) The p320 doesnt hold the striker fully to the rear. I didnt even touch it! Police officers (maybe) do an annual qualification and thats it. The latest of these suits was filed last week in US District Court in Massachusetts. The modular SIG P320 is among the most widely-owned handguns on the planet. Pity that some of the most common reactions fall into two over simplistic categories: 1. My elderly aunt drove her Volvo into a parked car, and the yard behind it, and the house behind that, while she was pressing the brake as hard as she could. Strangely the car kept accelerating, almost as if she were flooring the gas pedal. You arent a gunfighter, either. Too expensive to use their customers as beta testers. I dont know nothing about Sigs, I do know any gunm that goes off when I lay it on a table gets sold with a warning and I never touch that brand or model again. After watching a friend get killed by a Remington 700 by another friend and the ensuing fallout 31 years ago I decided that I didnt care if the P320 was fixed, it was getting sold. Is there any major military anywhere that ever issued one of their guns? Over the top, hammy and with incredible choleric energy, but as he once said, when you trying to seriously sell a scene that has space ship with obvious carboard walls, christmas lights and a guy in a rubber gorilla suit with a plastic horn on its head, if you play it lowkey youre dead the audience is gonna focus on how cheesy it all is. There used to be a problem, which is why Sig fixed it. He quickly too quickly tried to pick up the gun from the floor before anyone could see it, and in his haste, he picked it up with his finger on the trigger and accidentally fired the gun. How many times did Shatner actually watch it? Yes, conspiracy to defraud is a thing when ones @ss is on the line. Neither argument is relevant or very intelligent and certainly not useful. I am still waiting for the UPS man (not from the devil but from Sig) I will not hold my breath. Bagnells and other lawsuits ABC claims at least 54 discharges and 10 suits against SIG describe instances of P320s going off dating back to 2016, prior to the upgrade. Ever since the internet went mainstream I have read about the Sigs decline. The clearest memory I have about the many people experiencing post-upgrade discharges is a cop who set his P320 on a table, and several seconds after letting go, IT DISCHARGED ON ITS OWN! Big public relations disaster and Sig tries a second time to get the piece of shit to work and not go off when dropped. He likens it to a bow-and-arrow, pulled taut. DND/CAF is not in a position at this stage in its investigation to offer insight into the potential causes because our investigation scope is broader than the technical aspect pertaining to the unintended discharge of the pistol.. It alleges that Walter Collette, Jr., a police officer with the Somerville (Mass.) I wont argue theyre wrong, I dont own one, dont want to. selling the 365 with strikers breaking? Have you ever noticed that big trouble usually comes in groups of 3. And many departments across the country have had to lower their standards for passing qualifications just to be able to hire on and keep officers. Bagnell told TTAG that he believes the problem with the striker-fired P320 is an inadequate sear/striker connection (he has images he says illustrate this on his website). The suit also cites other occurrences of "un-commanded" discharges with the 320 while holstered. 01:10. The military is much smarter and no, the gun is not junk. In the case of the 320, lightning is striking the same place an awful lot. PDs are dropping them from contracts. , 54 people all shooting themselves. The thing is, youd probably need to generate many Gs of force in both directions simultaneously. All those customers who paid $1600 now had a limited function paper weight. But breaking news here, skippy. Asking for a friend. So I think it is unconscionable, given the number of incidents of this gun defectively discharging without a trigger pull, would necessitate that someone order it to be recalled and only SIG can do that.. Unless they have to fire their weapon in an on-duty incident most officers only fire their weapons just before and/or at qualifications, which depending on the department are annual or semi-annual. Then either the gun somehow managed to magically clear both the broken tab and foreign body to continue to operate. To give you an example of early self-propelled lawn mowers if you lost your grip on the handles the mower would not shut off and it would take off on its own right down the street all by itself. Got a 40 SW P320 SC on my hip now, got one in 9mm within reach, so far neither has decided to trip the sear without my help. You simply may not PREFER one make to another, or may simply dislike another make, but were to the point in semi-auto pistol production history where amongst the big brands, the only real distinctions are preference. They admitted their problem and fixed it. Liberal, Conservative. But hey, in ruthless, lawless, Capitalvania were life is considered cheap and expendable no one gives a shit, especially the Far Right that screams about abortions and then kills off the children that were not aborted with loaded guns laying around the house. The new Kirk does suck. Asked if the guns in these cases could have been mishandled, Villani responds, When I see videos of police officers getting out of their car and their weapon discharges in their holsters, nah, theres a problem with the gun. ABC then ran bodycam footage of a pre-upgrade P320 firing as a Michigan state trooper exited his patrol car in 2016 with no mention of the results of any subsequent investigation. No you haters are not smarter than the US military, who tested the P320 far more than your favorite YouTuber ever did. And they think hey have an actual legit lawsuit on their hands? there is no better. This is this same company that couldnt build their own freaking rifles after multiple attempts (Sig SG550 series) when that rifle had been made in Switzerland for years without issue. A fellow kept his DA revolver in the desk. Not only is it now the designated sidearm of all branches of the U.S. military, there are over a million of them in civilian hands. Its not happening on your person without some catastrophic event. SIG is choosing to litigate their problems away. . Sigs are crap! He wanted TTAG to convey that hes pro-Second Amendment. The list is long proving gun manufactures were well aware of this problem now for 121 years yet they abandoned this when the Glock infested the gun market. 00:03. With Biden spending outrageous amounts of money, whats 100 million here or there? in 2021," Bagnell said of the overall scope of the concern . The Defiant regardless of who is the captain. Stinking Lawyers and quota cops. This reminds me of when Gretchen Carlson sued Fox News for sexual harassment and she got 20 million dollars. The P320s and P365s were junk, plain and simple. I bought a P320 and went through the voluntary upgrade. That is the point of most of the video at the end of the article. Remember the highly trained FBI officer whose gun went off in a nightclub? Oct 20, 2022 #36 ; vh20 said: . Yes, its reliable, but no more so than most other major brands well known models. A holstered base P320 allegedly had a mysterious accidental discharge without pulling the trigger. Second, your claim that the military is dumping because theyre problematic? Were not the only ones who have noticed the lawsuits. Hey, Im glad theres somethings we agree on! JTF-2 is the only unit in. Being highly trained doesnt eliminate stupidity. Picard if Im limited to NCC-1701. I dont consider the drop-bang issue a failure and Sigs response was actually above any real need, except to perhaps deflect any easy wins for slime ambulance chasers I get that. Dude, your story is THREE years old. Seems kind of like a Sig apologist article. The second, longer version of the ABC story again included comments from Joshua Harrison, the consultant ABC hired to independently assess the P320. Notify me of follow-up comments by email.