The series, which is based on Caroline Kepnes novels, You and Hidden Bodies, is largely focused on Joe, a murderous and obsessive man with numerous mental health struggles. When she is in love, she enjoys stealing from and murdering her victims. Copyright 2023 StudeerSnel B.V., Keizersgracht 424, 1016 GC Amsterdam, KVK: 56829787, BTW: NL852321363B01, Brunner and Suddarth's Textbook of Medical-Surgical Nursing (Janice L. Hinkle; Kerry H. Cheever), Civilization and its Discontents (Sigmund Freud), Business Law: Text and Cases (Kenneth W. Clarkson; Roger LeRoy Miller; Frank B. There is no definitive answer to this question as it is difficult to diagnose someone based on their behavior without knowing their thoughts and motivations. is a horrific thing that people have, we always must remember that people have problems like. The 33-year-old actor's comment was made in response to Colbert asking him: "Do you have anything to say to the people out there that say they want to date Joe, despite the minor flaw of murdering people?" "It's not a clinical portrayal of a serial killer," Badgley said after defending fans. Yet, the series doesn't acknowledge this reality. It also makes us a lot wiser in trusting our own gut and our own wisdom," she says. It's not like a strep test with 'yes, you have strep,' or 'no, you don't.'". raised him, and even taught him an education. On top of that, he normalizes all his toxic characteristics, underlining that he does so in the name of love. As part of this process, the individual is first idealized, then devalued, re-examined, and eventually discarded when no longer necessary. He thinks about himself as a passionate lover and wants to take away all the problems from his girlfriends life even if it means killing her best friend. Both narcissistic and borderline individuals usually experience chronic instability in their personal Continue Reading 36 Sponsored by PureCare Knee Protector Despite Love always telling Joe that she does what she does to protect their family, Loves relationship with Theo says otherwise. 1999;156(8):1244-1249. Create your own unique website with customizable templates. In some ways, Goldberg embodies both conditions because he's constantly violent when he believes a person has wronged him, a common justification people with both illnesses make for their behavior. Ever.". The cycle must be identified in order to break free. As soon as he discovered that he was the murderer, he killed Beck and Candace, covered his tracks, and moved on. A few additional symptoms that psychopathy has when compared to ASPD include a lack of guilt, excessive vanity, charisma, and a lack of empathy. Moving away from the bustle of LA and the bloody aftermath they left there in Season 2 to start a new life in the burbs, all seemed well for the newlywed couple. He fears that he wont be able to protect his son, Henry, from what he himself was subjected to as a child, and he struggles to form a connection with him. He also demonstrates characteristics of narcissistic personality disorder, experts say. "You". Let us break down his character and actions to view the psychological perspective of Joe Goldberg. Stalking is a good way to get there. Protective Services came and sent him to a Group Home for Boys in New York. Joe devalues his wife, Love, while also gaining his bosss affection in the shows latest season. I utilize my eclectic variety of skills to inform my mental health practice and provide my clients with the best skills to be able to manage their mental health. Goldberg "seems to be an amalgam of personality traits at abnormal levels that are constructed to make a good story and create a character that elicits a certain amount of empathy" in viewers, despite the fact he murders people, Rutledge told Insider. Joe Goldberg from You or Dan Humphrey from Gossip Girl are two of the most recognizable characters you may have come across. We Need To Talk About The Home & Away Twins With A Telepathic Connection Who Werent Actually Related, We Need To Talk About How Love Is The Real Psychopath Of You, 8 True Crime Shows To Stream After American Murder: The Family Next Door, Some Extremely Baffling Info Has Come To Light About Ellys Time On The Bachelor, We Need To Talk About The Home & Away Twins With A Telepathic Connection Who Werent Actually Related. individuals' personal memories and ideas," which why Joe would defend the person he loved to any situation that presents to them. Access your favorite topics in a personalized feed while you're on the go. a woman, he needs to be overprotected. But in the end, he didnt. With both Freud and Jung dealing with earlier life and A resentful stalkers' goal is to intimidate and frighten. While we've known Joe Goldberg to be the obsessive stalker with murderous tendencies for three seasons of You, Love Quinn proved that she was the true psycho of the series in Season 3. All rights reserved. He is portrayed by Penn Badgley in his first villainous role. Another reason why ASPD and psychopathy are often used interchangeably and continue to be so difficult to separate is that both are mainly studied in terms of their effect on society, as opposed to the impact they have on the person inflicted by them. Although he has done so much wrong, Goldberg still thinks he is a perfect individual, and lacks guilt to take accountability for his actions or even feel empathy towards the people who he has violated. (2018). Psychoanalysis of "You"'s Joe Goldberg. 2019;47(2):267-268. doi:10.29158/JAAPL.003849-19. Joe Goldberg is one of those rare sociopaths who come across as very charming. Despite Love thinking that she was killing to protect her marriage and family, she was just needlessly killing with no restraint. And its pretty iconic. "Joe [Goldberg] would be a good example of misdiagnosis," Scott said. Like 'Twilight' before it, Netflix's 'You''s main character is far from desirable - and yet, numerous fans still adore their every move. So far, two seasons have been released, and the highly anticipated third season is coming out this October. The Id is described as the "unconscious energy" that strives to satisfy basic sexual and aggressive drives. Copyright 2020 mentalhealthmatters-cofe.org. The series chronicles a young bookstore manager with unsavory tendencies (to say the least), and with the release of the show's second season, it has stirred some fascinating questions about why we fall for psychopaths. I utilize art therapy and bibliotherapy in my mental health work, and I work with individuals struggling with mental illness, as well as their loved ones. While Joe had already been turned off Love since he learned that she was basically the same person as him at the end of Season 2, Natalies murder was what really spelled the end of the Quinn-Goldberg love story. "People use the word 'psychopath' colloquially to describe a person whose behavior defies social norms and conventional understandings of right and wrong," Kelly Scott, a therapist at Tribeca Therapy in Manhattan, told Insider. What's Realistic About the Depiction of Stalking in You? Realistically, if it wasnt for Joes help, Love wouldve been charged with Natalies murder in Episode 2. Psychopaths tend to be charming at an initial impression; this is why no one ever suspects Joe in either season, and both fans and characters believe that Joe is a likeable person while the people who are against his horrible deeds are viewed as the antagonists. He was a sociopath,had co- dependency issues and as slightly hinted by dr. Nick he can have 2 personalities. Then once they pinned Natalies murder on a dead Gil and all seemed sorted, Love decided to open her mouth and let the Conrads know that she was actually the one who killed Natalie. 38/40. That was, of course, until Love caught wind of Joes attention shifting away from her and onto neighbour, Natalie Engler. Despite being fully aware that she had two guests upstairs one of whom literally ran the search party for Natalie Engler Love loudly screamed about how she murdered Natalie. And the only reason she was able to do these thingswithout being disturbed by the public was because Love had the funds to open the bakery alone. These individuals often have a poor understanding of dating rituals as well as a sense of entitlement to a relationship. Naturally, one would be charmed by Joe Goldberg. We know what he's doing is wrong, so why do we root for him? Belmont, CA: Wadsworth-Thomson Learning. 2. Stalking: What to Do and How to Stay Safe, What's Not Realistic About Joe's Behavior in You, Behind the Keyboard: Spotting Digital Dating Abuse, The Role of Genetics in Narcissistic Personality Disorder, The Signs of Grandiose Narcissism and How to Deal With It, God Complex: What It Means and Why People Have Them, Understanding Bipolar Disorder and Narcissism. In season 2, however, flashbacks to Goldberg's past suggest he could actually be none of those and have an attachment disorder. It'll mean the world. However, it is so much more than that. Ltd. All Rights Reserved, Ariana Grandes Film On Sweetener Tour Has Got Netflix & YouTube Into A Bidding War, Happy Birthday Meghan Markle! His upbringing is influenced by strong morals, idealistic beliefs, and a desire to lead a better life. Joseph "Joe" Goldberg is the villainous main protagonist of the Netflix thriller series You, which is based on the novel of the same name by Caroline Kepnes. Some choose specific victims while others choose random victims based on a general sense of injustice and grievance with the world. Even though he is outright creepy, you can't really. Joe turned a real corner in Season 3 and made the decision to stop killing people to make life better for his son. Cognitive behavioral therapist Dr. Avigail Lev, director of Bay Area CBT Center and founder of CBT Online, gets more specific, diagnosing Joe with covert malignant narcissism. Joe Goldberg has established specific coping methods when it comes to functioning in high Although his morals are clearly flawed, Joe Goldberg sticks to them relentlessly. "A diagnosis is almost never clean-cut and disorders overlap. This is because he is so clear about his intentions that even when he is committing a serious crime, he is clean in his own mind. Joe seems like a hopeless romantic Sign up for notifications from Insider! Cynthia Vinney, PhD is an expert in media psychology and a published scholar whose work has been published in peer-reviewed psychology journals. "What we can learn from psychopaths like Joe," Neo says, "is that we need to have a lot better boundaries. There are people willing to assist you in your time of need. So, to get to the bottom of the You phenomena, we turned to psychologist Perpetua Neo, DClinPsy, for insight on how psychopaths manage to suck us in. "The show has this false layering of hope that [Joe] can get better or that [he] can have remorse or that [he] can change," Lev observes, "and [he can't]." locked in a glass cage and torture him. Some argue that Joe is simply selfish and manipulative, while others believe that his actions and thoughts stem from a much deeper issue. Joe seems to fall into a little of each some symptoms of being antisocial. Fredrick, C. (2020, August 17). problems daily, especially regarding his narcissistic, antisocial, or serial killer ways. You is an American psychological thriller Netflix series which premiered in the year 2018. (2001). You're getting to know this person's weaknesses and their strengths and their needs and their desires. Malignant narcissists exhibit the traits associated with narcissistic personality disorder, including grandiosity, entitlement and lack of empathy, but also have antisocial tendencies, including a lack of remorse and blaming others for their actions. Season three of You is unique in that Joe becomes a father, and we get to see more of his childhood and his insecurities in becoming a parent. Sign up to our newsletter, and follow us on Instagram and Twitter. I have watched a bit of the series, so I know what's going on (although I did just get some spoilers! Joe is not a control freak on the bed and loves his girl to come above him and dominate. The release reignited Twitter speculations about Goldberg's mental health that have been swirling since season 1. As Jung says, "the This is an accurate example of how psychopaths gaslight others. Also, he has a sign of being an individual who can be very She is emotionally manipulative, controlling, and insecure, and her behavior reflects this. Sarah Lynn is an ESTP personality type with both a feminine and masculine side. Narcissism varies in severity from person to person. As we get to know more of Joes past, other conditions that arise because of his troubled childhood begin to surface. THE PSYCHOANALYSIS OF JOE GOLDBERG | Netflix Series You | Perspectives from a Christian Therapist 388 views Sep 16, 2020 25 Dislike Share Wholistic Healing 481 subscribers In this video I am. So let You serve as a guidebook on what not to do in a new relationship. Abandoned as a child, Child 10. And just as Joe had a tragic childhood, which he leverages for sympathy, people in real life can do the same: "A compelling story about how sad their childhood was evokes this caretaker instinct." She relied heavily on Joe this season to clean up her murders and craft stories to ensure that the killings never pointed back to her. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. As we see in season 2 and season 3, his troubled childhood and the fact that he was abandoned by his mother seemingly gave Joe severe codependency issues. Joe Goldberg from You. He also tends to hold women hostage when he is interested in them, Attachment disorders typically develop in early childhood when a child has unhealthy or difficult relationships with family due to emotional or physical abuse or neglect, according to the American Academy of Child and Adolescent Psychiatry. Mental Health Specialist & Coach - Author - Bibliotherapist - Book Reviewer My name is Ashley Nestler, and I have my master's of social work with an emphasis in mental health, as well as certifications in mental health coaching, art therapy coaching, crystal healing, dialectical behavior therapy, and bibliotherapy. Joe also loves kids and wants to protect their childhood for the same reason. named Joe Goldberg and the woman named Guinevere Beck. Books, and horror, especially, have helped me a lot through my struggles with my mental health, and I enjoy sharing the healing power of books with others. This is really well done, Justin. It can come out in parenting and using your child to meet your own needs in a way that is massively detrimental to your child's needs," like Goldberg's mother is seen doing in flashbacks during season 2. The popular Netflix series, You, recently released its third season. Joe is a narcissist who desperately seeks to fill his emptiness because he craves supply. What Is Narcissistic Personality Disorder (NPD)? Joe Goldberg is often described as a psychopath, but this is largely because the term psychopath has become a popular tag for the (fictional and real-life) violent killers that grace our screens. However, some experts believe that Joe Goldberg from the Netflix series You may be a sociopath. Trust your intuition, watch for the red flags, and, for God's sake, buy some curtains. But according to mental health experts, Goldberg's mental health is more complicated, especially since the term "psychopath" doesn't hold much meaning, medically speaking. violating other people in different ways. So far, two seasons have been released, and the highly anticipated third season is coming out this October. Joe Goldberg is one of those rare sociopaths who come across as very charming. Save my name, email, and website in this browser for the next time I comment. Of course, Joe is fictional and You is entertainment, so the TV show's portrayal of the character, and the hope that's built into the story could be seen as taking the romance narrative trope of the man seeking redemption through love to the extreme, Furthermore, Hatters Friedman notes that You and some fans' attraction to Joe could be seen as the continuation of a trend thats long been part of popular culture. Since he is a fictional character, the more we find out about him in subsequent seasons, the more accurate a diagnosis of his mental state can be made. Joe "I don't wanna kill anymore"Love the whole season #YOUSEASON3 #YouNetflix pic.twitter.com/evUBbbP2HW, Authentiictrash (@LordFranku) October 19, 2021. Finally, his violent tendencies make him a predatory stalker, especially when it comes to characters like Benji and Ryan. Design: Cierra Miller/STYLECASTER. Joes goal in life is to torture and kill, and he enjoys doing so. References Our hero has a habit of falling obsessively in love with women and killing anyone who threatens to come in between them. they have gone through, which connects them unconsciously. He cant be in love with anything, no matter how much he is addicted or obsessed with it. Joe Goldberg Joe Goldberg is a young man who seems to be in his early to mid-20s. Verywell Mind's content is for informational and educational purposes only. To win over his ever-changing objects of desire, Joe also employs appalling means that are highly illegal. According to Mental Health America, symptoms of codependency include a need to control others and an unhealthy dependence on relationships. When one problem had finally been dealt with (thanks to Joe, mind you), Love just had to make a new issue to give her life some purpose. Quinn, his son and newfound friends, which shows us a different side of The memes (oh, the memes *spoiler warning*) about You currently littering the internet all seem to have one thing in common: They support main character Joe Goldberg despite his manipulative, violent, and downright psychopathic behavior. Netflix came out with an unforgettable TV Series named "YOU." Penn Badgley played a Movies, TV shows, and even Joe's beloved books depict men pursuing romance by "accidentally" bumping into their love interest or continuing to pursue her even after she's said she isn't interested. Delilah Alves. Trauma isnt the primary cause of Joes antisocial and narcissistic tendencies, but it does play a big part in the development of such disorders and behaviors. Joe devalues his ex-girlfriends in order to manipulate the narrative. In contrast to Joe, a Cancer would be someone who would bring out the best in you. ", According to Lev, "Stalking is seen in the full spectrum of narcissism." Growing up, Joe became parentless when his mother abandoned him, and he grew up in a group home where he was profoundly mistreated by the other boys in the house. However, his charming demeanor keeps him under the radar even as his body count rises, and Joe Goldberg keeps falling in love again and again. style is a defense mechanism intended to ward off feelings of anxiety". You can stream all three seasons of Youon Netflix. I am the author of three novels, and my poems and short stories have been published in various anthologies. Through the years Mr. Mooney abused Joe. self-defense to save himself and his mother from his father. He is a great example of how someone can be diagnosed using psychoanalysis. of these categories. but as the show progresses, the more dangerous he becomes, it's clear that he's a sociopath, because now he's moved into antisocial behaviors. You can begin working on self-esteem and self-compassion as soon as you understand whats going on. In addition to my work in mental health, I am also a professional book reviewer. You is a show that focuses on Joe Goldberg. Am J Psychiatry. However, while this shift in dynamic started to finally mellow out Joe, it turned Love into even more of a psychopath. The Complexity of The Psychopathic Mind., Leiden, Luke. He hurt his loved ones and others whom he suspected. This is a Premium document. Hence, Joe seems to have a form of ASPD (sociopathy), as opposed to him being a complete psychopath. By Cynthia Vinney The fact that he has no remorse about killing any of them just shows that he could honestly even kill Paco if he somehow becomes a threat to Joe. Neither of them are good people. His use of enhanced vocabulary and choice of words exhibits how intelligent and educated he is. In the end, no matter how much he loves someone, it seems like he will always choose to save himself no matter what. Joe meets many relationship challenges in season three with his partner, Love Grand Canyon University: PSY- I can really see the thought you have put into this, and your analysis of the show is excellent. He is a bookstore clerk, and that is where he gained most of his knowledge. I specialize in borderline personality disorder, eating disorders, schizoaffective disorder, anxiety, depression, and PTSD. Originally posted by omisteriodasduasirmas. 40 Comments Please sign inor registerto post comments. He is a great example of how someone can be diagnosed using psychoanalysis. By: Ayesha Nayak. While Joe Goldberg is an extreme type of psychopath, we can't guarantee milder versions won't enter your life. stressful situations due to how he grew up. You is narrated by Joe Goldbergs ongoing monologues; these solo dialogues are what manipulate streamers into supporting him, and antagonising the characters who attempt sabotaging the stalkers devious plans. At the same time, Scott said it's important to note that not all people with antisocial personality disorder or an attachment disorder will act violently. Rejected stalkers want both revenge for the rejection and reconciliation with the person who rejected them, with their inclination toward both impulses changing on a regular basis. Ryan2 years ago what I needed to start mine Students also viewed PSY 255 Trait Theory Short Answer Worksheet As for antisocial behavior, Joe does not have any friends, nor does he make any effort to befriend others, aside from children who he feels obligated to care for. Joe Goldberg possesses a few characteristics that are beneficial to him. Impulsive decision-making, antisocial behavior, and/or little to no guilt and empathy are just a few other traits aside from superficial harm found in psychopaths, which can clearly be seen in Joe. To define stalking, it is viewed as an illogical or irrational preoccupation with another individual. He read people so well that any organization would benefit greatly from him. Joe Goldberg, in his role as You, possesses many of these characteristics as a murderer. Lev cautions that despite the way it comes across in the series, "people with [narcissistic personality disorder], they don't really have much remorse and they don't really feel guilt. Joe does not know his biological mother, Sandy, and he And he's not willing to leave your romance to chance, so even though you don't know it, he follows you, he manipulates you, he controls you. Joe even admits to experimenting with polyamory because he believes it will give him an excuse to go home. After being in So although some people with narcissistic traits can benefit from therapy, malignant narcissists "actually get worse with therapy. The main couple in Season 3 has a very interesting connection. Joe will do whatever in his means to help them out in household that has made him codependent as an adult. Joe Goldberg has been a CIA covert action officer, corporate intelligence director, international political consultant, and currently is a college instructor and writer. Apart from my professional experience, I am a survivor of Schizoaffective Disorder, Quiet Borderline Personality Disorder, Fibromyalgia, multiple eating disorders, Generalized Anxiety Disorder, and Complex PTSD. He is attractive according to societys standards of beauty, his monologues in the show consist of great humor which makes him a likeable and relatable character, and the way he treats children shows us that hes rather polite, caring, and respectful (obviously not enough to respect peoples privacy). Goldberg wrongly assumes that being in a relationship with a woman means being entitled at all times to her complete attention and marks him as the only significant person in her life. Freud stated, "adult defenses, are related to early childhood experiences" (Burger, 2019), making sense why he acts how he is :P) but another reader likely wouldn't have. Some Extremely Baffling Info Has Come To Light About Ellys Time On The Bachelor, 23 Sep 2020 Klestzick, Rebecca. found a New York bookstore, Mooney's, as a manager. A lot of this comes down to Love having the luxury of family money, which has always helped to bail her out of sticky situations. Click here to find out how. Plans out his murders, Just do has a cover story, & it is able to fully backtrack & cover everything up #YouNetflix #YOUSEASON3 pic.twitter.com/lXScPy2jHK. No need to be fancy, just an overview. Joe seemingly suffers from ASPD, with hints of psychopathy that cause him to commit heinous crimes but remain charming nonetheless. That's why later in life Goldberg becomes obsessively attached to women he believes can give him what he needs and is motivated to get the love, or idea of love, he craves by any means necessary while still showing glimpses of empathy. Secondly, he was a serial killer, which took some real thinking. codependent due to his childhood. Joe Goldberg is a character in the novel You, who is a textbook psychopath. One reason it's difficult to pinpoint a single mental health condition for Goldberg is the simple fact "You" was created for television, according to Pamela Rutledge, a social scientist who researches the intersection of media, human behavior, and neuroscience. Vulnerable narcissists may be more prone to using the cycle of emotional abuse over physical abuse or coercion. And in many cases in reality, people do choose the dark road. You may be able to seek help if you are being abused multiple times. Trust your intuition, watch for the red flags, and, for God's sake, buy some curtains. He is also very manipulative and has a lack of empathy. In the end, As stated in Kwon article, "At first, the Joe Goldberg wants you. Proudly created with Wix.com. When we dive into his past, these presenting problems have Goldberg shows signs of antisocial personality disorder, narcissism, and codependency in season 1. him. Even though society thinks this Rejected stalkers stalk their victims in response to the dissolution of a former relationship, most often a former partner but sometimes a parent or friend. He has often been described as a psychopath, but opinions have differed on what exactly ails our hero. When you visit the site, Dotdash Meredith and its partners may store or retrieve information on your browser, mostly in the form of cookies. generating situations develop strategies for dealing with threatening people. 12 Oct 2020 When Love no longer provides Joe with the supply he requires, he ends her life. If Goldberg was not as good-looking, hilarious, sweet, or smart as he is portrayed in the show, with a different financial status, his character would not be well liked by fans, or even the side characters who trust him. And no matter what he's doing to win the heart of his latest obsession, including theft and murder, he sees all of his behavior as justified because it is done to help her and their relationship. But at least Joe was methodical and careful in his approach to murdering people. Worrall, Daina. Why Does Everyone like Joe Goldberg?" Another season 2 scene, when Goldberg says he won't kill Forty even though he hates him because he means so much to Love, further suggests Goldberg has empathy, to an extent. Looking into the perspective that Freud's structure of Id, Ego, and Superego, we can Eventually, Joe finds purpose in keeping Henry safe, and this endeavor becomes a main focus of his. Hence, Joe clearly has issues with codependency, which inform the relationships he forms with women. Privacy By clicking Sign up, you agree to receive marketing emails from Insider Verywell Mind content is rigorously reviewed by a team of qualified and experienced fact checkers. He starts mast**bating as he watches Beck while standing outside her house. And we try to do that for other people, especially if we are very understanding of other people. Here, we delve into what scholars and mental health professionals know about stalking to discover just how realistic You is. I use my personal experiences with my mental health and health to inform my work. ", Joe's behavior could even seem romantic "to those of us who have been brought up on Disney and rom-coms practically IV-dripped into our consciousness. And when we hear a story, it releases oxytocin in our brainaka the bonding hormone. Your email address will not be published. Joe was mentally ill. His issues also seem to stem a lot from his childhood experiences, which make him obsessively codependent on his partner (or someone he envisions as being his partner), and when things dont work out, the antisocial (ASPD) tendencies kick in. A relationship that is abusive or harmful does not have to be physically violent. Beforehand, let us go over some Joe love bombs his victims, and he makes himself your world.". This is at least in part because, as Hatters Friedman points out, "Therapy requires honesty and I'm not sure Joe's been honest with anyone in the series" including himself.